We've danced around this issue in other debates, I think we need to dive headfirst into what sin is. I'm trying to lead a discussion, not dominate one. So rather than give a long piece with a ton of scripture, I'll give a little commentary for now, let others post scriptures if they disagree, and I'll have some on standby. Before we can talk about what actions are sins, we need to understand the concept that sin IS action. It's come up before in various debates, but it's quite relevant here that Hebrew is an action-oriented language. I don't think a person can quite grasp that without having at least a fundamentalist knowledge OF Hebrew. Adjectives are rare, because it's all about the action. Even a noun is a noun performing an action. Sin in the Bible IS first and foremost, a verb. It can also be a noun, but only by extension of the verb. A sin (noun) is an action which involves sinNING(verb). It is NOT really an adjective, as people have made it. We are not DEFINED by sin. It is not 100% accurate to describe us as "sinful" or "full of sin." There is a kernel of truth in the statement, but a twisting of truth, as well. G-d created us, and G-d is good, so no person can be composed wholly of evil or sin. We all have a little spark of the divine in us, which nothing can put out, because the substance of our being was once one with G-d, before the Earth was created. You can try to dampen that spark, make it shrink down to the smallest ember, build walls around it so nobody can see it, but you can't ever put it out, because G-d is eternal. We CAN be accurately described as "sinful" but it depends on context. This is the easiest way in English to speak of our tendency TO sin. BUT it is only ACCURATE to say that one is "sinful" IF it is an extension of the verb "to sin." You can't just pull a sin out of thin air. It's a sin only if G-d says it's a sin. Perfection came first, so the default state of being IS sinless. But sin has corrupted all of us, made us imperfect and fallen. But again, this is only true as an extension of the ACTION of "sinning." We are fallen and imperfect BECAUSE we sin, and seem unable to stop ourselves from it completely. Traditional wisdom holds the opposite. It says we sin("action") as a result of a "sinful nature"(adjective). This is the tail wagging the dog, the ACTION as an extension of the ADJECTIVE. It is a Greek mindset. If one has not sinned, then one is sinLESS. It's just that simple. The Hebrew mindset says: If we are said to be "sinful" it is because we sin. The Greek mindset says: We sin because we are "sinful." Our mere existence is NOT a sin. If our existence were offensive to G-d, He would not have made us. We are "sinful" only because we habitually sin, and we must be careful in even using sin as an adjective ("sinful"). So many use it in other ways, separated from the ACTION of sinning (or having sinned) to say that evil dominates us and defines us. This, to me, is a slap in the face to G-d. Anybody want to start giving some EARLY biblical references to sin? I have some, if not, but I'd like an interactive (and RESPECTFUL please!) discussion here, so I'll open the floor up before I post them.

Post edited by: MattBob_SquarePants, at: 2007/06/06 20:08